Julia Gordon-Bramer: Tarot for Growth, Mysticism & Building a Soul-Aligned Business | Ep55

A tarot card reader for over 45 years, Julia Gordon-Bramer is an author, scholar, poet, and professional tarot card reader. She has toured the United States and the UK, the past couple years talking tarot and promoting her recent books, Tarot Life Lessons (2023, Destiny Books) and The Occult Sylvia Plath (2024, Destiny Books). Julia Gordon-Bramer has appeared on MTV, Nick at Nite, Gaia network’s Beyond Belief, Coast to Coast AM, Next Level Soul, and other programs. A former professor of Creative Writing and Humanities, her passion is the poet and writer Sylvia Plath, whose name she hopes to elevate from her depressive, suicidal limitations. In 2013, The Riverfront Times voted Julia Gordon-Bramer St. Louis’s Best Local Poet and she has published numerous award-winning stories and poems. With tarot clients all over the world, she makes her home in St. Louis, Missouri.

In this episode of the Successful Spiritualpreneur Podcast, Christian sits down with Julia Gordon-Bramer—a professional tarot reader, published scholar, and poet whose work bridges the worlds of mysticism, literature, and spiritual entrepreneurship. With over 45 years of experience, Julia brings a unique depth to the conversation, blending grounded wisdom with powerful intuitive insight.

If you're a spiritual entrepreneur curious about integrating intuition into your business, or someone seeking clarity in your own path, this conversation offers eye-opening stories, deep wisdom, and an invitation to trust the unfolding of your purpose.

Connect with Julia Gordon-Bramer:

Follow on Instagram: @jgordonbramer

Explore her website: https://www.juliagordonbramer.com/

Get her books here: https://www.amazon.com/stores/author/B00LS5NSMI

Core Themes

• Tarot as a tool for personal growth and spiritual guidance
• Turning a passion into a thriving profession
• The deeper, mystical side of Sylvia Plath often overlooked
• Life lessons from decades of tarot experience
• Integration of spirituality, scholarship, and entrepreneurship
• Authenticity and divine timing in purpose-led work
• Using tarot to support life decisions

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Transcript

Christian
What's up beautiful people? This is Christian from the Successful Spiritualpreneur Podcast. And today I'm very excited to have Julia Gordon-Bramer on the show. And you can imagine her as being a cross between Greg Braden and Jen Sincero. So she's kind of like a blend who brings spirituality and also a certain sass to the table. And Julia has been a professional tarot card reader for over 45 years, so it's a very long time. She knows so many things about tarot, and apart from that, she's also an author, scholar, and poet. She has toured the United States, the UK, Dubai, in the past couple years, talking about tarot and promoting her recent books, which are Tarot Life Lessons and The Occult Sylvia Plath, which Sylvia Plath, some of you might know, she's a very famous poet and Julia also has appeared on MTV Nick at night, Gaia's network and Beyond belief Coast to Coast AM as well as the next level soul podcast Welcome to the show Julia

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Thank you. Thank you so much, Christian. And just a note of correction, I didn't get to Dubai. That's forthcoming, but not yet.

Christian
Okay, beautiful. So welcome to the show and I'd love to, the first question I would love to ask is what is your definition of a successful spiritualpreneur?

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah, I love that term, spiritualpreneur, by the way. I think it's having, I mean, for me, it's having the freedom to have my own schedule, to be my own boss, to plan my own day, to make enough money to live comfortably and to be happy. You know, that's it, right? ⁓ For me, anyway.

Christian
I love that. And I think currently it's a very interesting time because, you know, technology is evolving so fast and AI, you know, all the things. I think it's very interesting to see that a lot of people will be invited and pushed more into exploring who am I and what do I actually want to do with my life? Because there will be so many new opportunities and pathways for people opening up in the coming years.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah, yeah sure and ⁓ you know I have not used AI as far as with you know outside of ⁓ getting interview questions for a podcast that I did but my tarot card readings are through me. I know some people do use AI for tarot readings even ⁓ as I said or as you said in my introduction I've been reading for most of my life it's actually over 46 years now and

such, ⁓ I've never had ⁓ that need to computerize it. ⁓ I would like to consider AI for things like video editing and some of the tasks that I'm less ⁓ equipped to do and don't enjoy quite as much as that personal connection with reading for people.

Christian
And from your perspective, since you have such a deep insight of tarot and work with it for such a long time, what would you say makes it so special that we might not know because we haven't explored it as much as you did? What makes tarot so special?

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah,

I mean, ⁓ it's really a tool for personal growth. ⁓ It's more about personal growth than it is fortune telling. People do oftentimes ask me, can you see in the cards, is this going to happen? Is that going to happen? When am I going to meet my love? Things like that. And that's the fortune telling aspect. But I compare it to like dream analysis. So in the same way that our dreams are full of symbols,

and information for us, so are the cards. So the cards all have these different pictures that show us what we're going through, the direction of our energies if we keep doing things the way we're doing. I believe we all have this higher knowledge of where our energy's going. We all know that if we, maybe we act dishonestly, that's probably gonna.

come back to bite us later or something like that. And so the tarot will call it out. It will reveal, it'll give you a big heads up sometimes and it gives you the opportunity to change your energies. So I think it's a wonderful tool. I think people are really mistaken when they say to me, don't tell me anything bad because as I said, it's a heads up. It's an opportunity for them to turn that around. ⁓ But yeah, not everybody wants to be conscious.

Christian
Yeah, I love that. think with that being said, I terror is an incredible tool for also using in the business. I've used it many times to make business decisions.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
yeah, yeah, have regular clients. I have one after you today who ⁓ he's an investor. He's always having me look at his prospects. ⁓ You know, I always say it is a more personal thing so I can read it as a company may affect him. But I wouldn't read, you know, something like well back in the election who was going to be the next president.

That is an energy that is necessarily going to personally affect us. It could, I suppose, and if it does, it may show up in the cards. But those big world questions are not what I want to look at in Tarot. I want to make it more ⁓ particular to you.

Christian
Beautiful. I love that. And I think it's very fitting because our lives are very unique. with that being said, how did you, I would say, make Tarot a business, a profession? What are the kinds of... Yeah.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah.

Yeah, so

I ⁓ never set out to be a professional tarot card reader. ⁓ It evolved and it was kind of, think fate kind of decided it for me. ⁓ For many, many years, and I'm talking decades, it was just a hobby. It was a fun thing I did for my friends and my family. And ⁓ when I went to graduate school in 2007,

That was maybe the turning point because I would bring my cards with me to class and I'd read for my friends and they would say, will you come read at my party or will you do my wedding reception or will you do my graduation? And these events started to happen or even, you know, I'm pretty down and I could use your consult, you know, and it started to take a lot of my time and I had to value my time and I had other things going on and I was

⁓ a working mom and you know and so I had to start charging. ⁓ And so for a time you know I graduated got my MFA in creative writing and went on to teach on the graduate level in ⁓ Lindenwood University and the whole time I was just sort of doing tarot just as a little sideline gig but it began to grow and grow and grow and then it

came to the point that I was actually making a better living as a tarot card reader than a teacher, which isn't hard if anyone has any teaching experience. They know exactly what I'm talking about. And I had to cut some classes back. And I didn't quit teaching instantly. I had a conversation with my husband. And I went from full-time to part-time. And then I went to just teaching one class. And then it just wasn't worth it.

And I completely surrendered to my Tarot career, which has been wonderful, all I could ever want. And at the same time, I was really working on my scholarship of the poet Sylvia Plath. And I had published three books in that time. And I was working on this book, The Occult Sylvia Plath, that came out last year. And I really think that from a more divine orchestration,

Being a tarot card reader enabled me to have the freedom to pursue that Platt Scholarship, to make regular trips to Bloomington, Indiana, where her archives were, and sit and read all her books and letters and calendars and journals and everything for days. so I was, ⁓ you know, the freedom of working for myself as a tarot card reader has been such a blessing with my other passion of scholarship.

And I think maybe Sylvia pulled the strings so I could do this for her. Or maybe it's just the higher purpose that I was meant to do both. And it's really been a complementary career and very nurturing to me. And I never planned it. That's the beautiful thing. think when we know we're on path, it truly does unfold. We so often try to force things. We so often try to.

make things happen exactly when we want and lord knows I've been tested and had a lot of challenges and that last book I held up, The Occult Sylvia Plath, that's 15 years in the making and those 15 years I was trying to publish it the whole time and what happened was I kept improving and revising and it kept getting better and better and I would find new things and new things and new things again and so

We can't always, you know, we can have goals and we can have direction, but sometimes there's definitely a higher order and I had a lot of beautiful, ⁓ you know, synchronicities that brought that book to publication, which I could talk about if you'd like. And some things happened in the world that showed me that when I was trying to force it, ⁓ it wasn't ready for world reasons.

So some things had to come into alignment to kind of pave the way for this book. And it happened outside of what I was trying to happen, you know? So if that makes any sense to you.

Christian
Yeah, I love that. I think like very, you know, many, many, listeners might not know who, you know, Sylvia Plath is. So maybe you want to just briefly explain who she was and how your book shines a different light on her life.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. So Sylvia Plath was a very famous writer and poet. She died the year I was born in 1963. And she is probably, unfortunately, best known for her suicide and her drama. In the early 2000s, Gwyneth Paltrow and Daniel Craig starred as Sylvia Plath and her husband Ted Hughes. And they focused on the tumultuous marriage and the

and Plath's depression and ultimately her suicide. And that's what everybody knows. They were very beautiful. They were very talented. They were very successful. But people only know Plath for her drama, not her genius. And I really feel like one of my purposes to be here on this planet at all is to show her genius. mean, she was, what she could do with words was truly a magic spell.

And I show, going back to my very first book, Fixed Stars, Governor Life, Decoding Sylvia Plath. That's now out of print, but I do sell the PDF. It came out from Stephen F. Austin State University Press back in 2014. And I take her poems and aerial apart, and I show that each poem has like six clear different meanings, that she could make one set of words mean six different things.

you know, related, but she was truly a mystic. She had an active practice in mysticism. She had tarot cards on her desk table. On the cover here, this is her photographed with a crystal ball. That's actually her in the picture from the 1950s. she had ⁓ regular Ouija board sessions with her husband, and she wrote about astrology and...

and in astronomy and mythology was a passion alchemy was in there she was a an active mystic bibliomancy yeah it goes on and on

Christian
Wow, that's beautiful. I love that. That's incredible. how would you say, ⁓ why Sylvia Plath and Tarot? Like, those two are not necessarily connected, but in your life they are. Like, why do you have such a strong emphasis on both of these?

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Well, when I was in graduate school, ⁓ I was looking for a semester end project. And I had noticed, and I talked to my professor about this, Dr. Steven Schreiner, I said, there's a lot of tarot imagery in Platts aerial poems. And I pulled him aside and I showed him, look, here's the magician, and here's the empress, and here's the queen of swords, and blah, blah. ⁓ And he looked at me and he said,

I don't know what you're talking about. He said, nobody's ever done it. I couldn't find anything about it. And he'd never heard anything about it. And he knows Plath. So he said, make that your semester end project. And so what became my semester end project in 2007 turned into my life's work. So what I found was that Plath was operating on

so many levels and and ⁓ and she and and her husband said he is they were they were they knew about cabal of the new of alchemy ⁓ and they had they had basically structured their work both of them i believe that he had he was taught her a great deal about the occult and mysticism and and she was sort of the the magicians apprentice you know when she she learned and and

Possibly got better than him. I mean that's up for debate because Ted Hughes is hugely famous and very successful he was the poet laureate in England for a long time and ⁓ You know that there's no no insulting his talent either but but what Plath did and I guess just the tragedy of People not realizing it, you know not realizing the the expansiveness of her genius and that she was so much more than just this

confessional poet, which is how she's known, know, just kind of gloom and doom and depression and suicide. And my gosh, she was saying so much more than all of that. And that was in there too, no doubt. I mean, it was part of her life experience. I would never deny that. ⁓ But yeah, people have just missed so much about her. So ⁓ that's my passion. And if I'm here to do anything, know, sometimes I feel like a little bit like

John the Baptist, you know, ⁓ prepare ye the way, pay attention, look what this person has achieved.

Christian
Yeah, it's really wonderful. I think there's a lot of sides of Sylvia Plath, not that I her, but like from what you've said is that many, there's more shadows than lights and that's not negative, but there's just like, there's so many ways that she hasn't been explored and highlighted, you know? So I think ⁓ your book is a great way to explore different sides of her. ⁓ And in your other book, the...

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Correct.

Yeah.

Christian
tarot life lessons? what are some like yeah what are some of the most profound life lessons that you know the cards have taught you personally?

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah.

Yeah, well, so the book came from my journals. My working title was The Tarot Diaries. And I would have loved to have kept that because ⁓ it truly is my diary entries. And so it's like you're in my head. You're sitting with me as I'm doing some of these readings. And the things I, you know, how I read, I talk about the process. talk about

what intuition feels like and how I respond and how imperfect I am and sometimes somebody will bait me or trigger me. All of these things have come up. There are a lot of life lessons and I have improved and grown along with my clients and so I think that was part of what I was trying to teach.

The very first story is my own and it aligns with the Fool card. Each story aligns with a major arcana card in the tarot. And so the Fool card, my own, is the story of how I kind of wandered into tarot, ⁓ not ever planning that this would be my life calling and my career. ⁓ The ⁓ story for card number one, The Magician, is about a con artist who took a client of mine

an elderly widow ⁓ for everything she had, know, took all her money and ⁓ did it in this deceitful way, met her through Facebook and did it, you know, under the pretense of falling in love with her and she was lonely and she was ⁓ generous and sweet and ⁓ it was killing me and I was trying to warn her and I saw it happening and I did everything I could.

⁓ You know, sometimes as tarot card readers, ⁓ we get attached to our people. And it was ⁓ very sad. was ⁓ in ⁓ a spot where, ⁓ you know, I could not help her. ⁓ have, you know, couldn't, aside from like physically going and restraining her, you know, and that wasn't going to happen. ⁓ I have stories of addicts. ⁓ Some addicts got help.

Some addicts can't be helped. There was a terrible gambling addiction story. There's drug addiction stories. ⁓ There's a ⁓ murder that was revealed in the cards. And there's a manslaughter that was hidden by somebody that showed up in the cards. ⁓ All kinds of fascinating things that, you know, these are the stories that blew my mind. And I had to go home and write about them.

And as a creative writer, I wanted the details. I wanted to remember which cards I turned over and how the people responded and how they looked. there's one weird story of a woman who started impersonating me. That was kind of ⁓ an odd one. ⁓ So ⁓ yeah, there's many life lessons.

22 major arcana cards. So basically 22 stories. Although a couple of them I doubled up. A couple of them have a few layers to it. So you could even say like 24 or 26 stories in there. And I'm working on a sequel right now. So we'll see what becomes of that.

Christian
Beautiful, I love that. And what would you say, like, after such a long time teaching and reading and, you know, sharing tarot, basically, it's like, what keeps you passionate about tarot? Like, what is it that keeps you, you know, like, on it, hooked in a way?

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah, you know, I never get bored of it.

Right, I don't ever get bored of it. ⁓ It continues to fascinate me when I put cards down for a total stranger and they go, my god, and they explain what I've just revealed, you know, like I don't know your stuff, I don't know your background, and it's just an incredible thing to witness when I hit

time after time after time, sometimes with very specific details and can be very moving, very emotional. ⁓ I've had people tell me they get more out of a tarot card reading with me than they did a year of therapy. And I don't take responsibility for that. I call that spirit and I think that they were called to me, they were attracted to me for a reason, ⁓ because they're ready to hear it, basically. ⁓

I love helping people. I love personal connection. I think I'm made to go deep. I'm made to be intense with people. ⁓ I want to live this life with just a ⁓ knowledge and a passion and ⁓ connection. And Tarot allows me to do that. And so ⁓ most of my regular clients I do regard as friends.

And maybe that's a good thing, maybe that's a bad thing. But how can you read for somebody without loving them, right? Because I ask spirit to open my heart and make that connection. And there is love. And it's different kinds of love. Obviously, I don't want to cross any personal boundaries or anything like that. But it's a... ⁓

profession like no other and I have maybe a little more leeway than say a counselor or a life coach because I do have the spiritual aspect and a lot of people call me their counselor or life coach which I find a little amusing and I do say you know I'm not trained in that like please know that I do not have a certification I'm not you know I you know I I'm still

Christian
Hmm.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
for all intents and purposes. ⁓ Just, you know, fun. Entertainment maybe, but as I said, personal growth. And I want it to be meaningful. And I want people to come away with tools. And that's maybe where my background comes in. You know, I've studied Buddhism, I've studied the Tao. I'm a teacher ⁓ and student both of A Course in Miracles. ⁓

You know, I study Kabbalah, which is a never-ending study. ⁓ I have Christian roots in the Episcopal Church. You know, I have a very broad ⁓ spiritual background. And I think all of that fits into my tarot card readings. And so when I pull a card, sometimes there may be, you know, kind of ⁓ a Buddhist, you know, cone, you know, or a...

you know, some piece of wisdom that I've picked up or direction from Kabbalah or the Bible. And I incorporate all of that.

Christian
Yeah.

Beautiful. I love that. Yeah, it's funny you say that because ⁓ my wife, she's actually a teacher of A Course in Miracles. And yeah, it's something that I've studied as well. And yeah, it's interesting. like we put everything that who we are into the cards and into what we do and who we are. And yeah, I was going to ask you if you feel inspired to do a little reading.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Right.

I'd be happy to, yeah, to read for you right now.

Christian
Yeah, I think that'd be super fun.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Okay, okay. Is there something you'd like me to focus on or just a sort of in general thing?

Christian
Yeah. ⁓ So here's the situation. I'm going to say it for all the listeners so they know what's going on. ⁓ So in the recent couple of months, I've been feeling drawn more to help my wife in her business because I obviously have the agency and I have the tea brand, but also, and of course I've always like passively helping my wife. So ⁓

I'm looking into stepping a little bit more into an active role within her universe in terms of business. And yeah, just wondering what the cards are wanting to reveal, whether that's a good idea or not so good idea.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Okay.

Okay.

So you're just working with your wife. That's the focus here.

Alright, so I did ⁓ what I would call a horseshoe spread here and our initial energy is the Strength card and this is beautiful and she tames the beast and you know this could be the strength of your love for your wife, ⁓ know your strength and wanting to support her, all beautiful there. I am seeing you kind of launching out with some hard work here. Now this is the

This is the assembly line, you know, and he keeps a little for himself under the bench there. So, you know, it's just saying you're churning it out. You're helping him with it. Now, helping her with it, sorry. Now, the Fool in Reverse is our next card, and this is around three months. And I do believe, Christian, that you're saying, I'm not sure this is my direction, or ⁓ that you might feel...

sometimes that you're doing it differently or even that you did it badly. Occasionally the Fool in Reverse is a little bit of a self-attack, like, I screwed up, know, something like that. Now the top card here is the World in Reverse. And you know what I think? So the World card is not a bad card right side up, which is this way, or upside down, which is what I mean by in reverse. But it isn't your total self-actualization.

And I think that's the difference. It may be your wife's. And so it could be wonderful. You're supporting her. You love her. All good. But as your career, I'm not so sure. And what I do see is around six months, I have King of Pentacles. This is you feeling on top of things in whatever you're doing. Pentacles are the gold coin, money and career.

But a little further than that, I have the four of wands in reverse. So I believe, I think you're launching her and then you're going on to do something else. And so this time next year, we have a whole new beginning. Now, of Swords is a card that I read for an entrepreneur because aces are new beginnings and swords are about striking out. So it's the perfect entrepreneurial card.

you know, or spiritualpreneur card in your case. And so I would say you're launching her, you're building her, but it'll be less than a year and then you're onto your thing. So that's how a reading might go.

Christian
Hmm.

Beautiful. I love that. Yeah. And just to give a little bit more context to the reading for everyone who's listening, it's very interesting, the first card, the strength card, because that's usually, that's like our dynamic. Like I am the one who just like push and like very like a lot and intense, you know, like I work in kind of like bursts, right? And she's always like the one that like calms it down and you know, cause sometimes

Julia Gordon-Bramer
You

Christian
you work like the masculine just works too much in one direction. Just chill, like do a little bit and then cool down a little bit. Right. So that the strength car, it's a very common dynamic between you and then the assembly line makes total sense. I can totally see myself in that. So that's beautiful. And then the full, I think, I think I agree. Right. Like I think I'm happy to help her and launch her and give her more.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah.

Christian
umph and support, but it won't be long-term fulfilling, you know? So I totally agree ⁓ in the sense I have to live my own authentic self at some point.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. So that's an example of a reading.

You know, and I can do any subjects, know, sometimes I do money or health ⁓ or love, of course. The love is probably the most popular reading. ⁓ But yeah, you know, I can look at lots of relationships and if you're having problems with someone, if someone's estranged from you, we can go into that and try to understand what they're thinking or what you can do. ⁓ It's, yeah, it can be very helpful.

Christian
I love that.

Yeah, I love how Taro brings out those subtleties and especially if people look at them and they're like, okay, now I see why or certain things. ⁓ Yeah, I love that about Taro.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Mm-hmm.

Christian
Thank you so much for that reading and we're coming towards the end of show, but I would love to ask you a couple more questions about what you see as your legacy. What do you want to leave behind after you leave this physical plane?

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah, mean, certainly my Sylvia Plath work. I want that to be recognized. I want people to understand what a complex, brilliant woman she was, way beyond the drama, way beyond just expressing the darkness and the suicide, her real brilliance. I'm a creative writer, and so I'd love to leave my own creative writing. ⁓ I'm a...

currently looking at getting a memoir published of the years I ran a music magazine as a single mother in the 1990s. ⁓ that's been a project that I've had finished for literally decades. And ⁓ I'm just ready to get it published. I also want to get a collection of my poems published, and I have yet to do that. I've published a lot of individual poems, but no books. So those are important.

writing dreams for me. ⁓ But you know, maybe most important, I think I've been called here in these hard times ⁓ to be love and light and darkness. And ⁓ I want to be remembered for that. And I want others to be lifted by that. And maybe together we truly can bring about some positive change in this world. So... ⁓

So those are the most important things for me.

Christian
Beautiful. I love that. Yeah, I think a lot of people are, you know, maybe still going through some, you know, dark times, but I feel, I feel definitely if you are in a spiritual world, maybe it's about a bubble, but I think definitely like the world is getting better. Like people are waking up. Like there's more and more people who are just not, ⁓ yeah. Exactly. Who are just like.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
That's true.

Yeah, yeah, and that's inspiring.

Christian
Yeah, exactly. We all wake up one by one. Well, thank you so much for your time and your wisdom and your heart. It's been an honor to have you on. And yeah.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Yeah.

Thank you.

Thanks. And if anyone would like to reach me, they can just look up Julia Gordon-Bramer. Gordon is G-O-R-D-O-N. Braimer is B as in boy, R-A-M as in Mary, E-R. And juliagordonbramer.com. they can email me. They can find my phone number and call or text me. And I'm on WhatsApp. I do readings all around the world. ⁓ I'm on Zoom, of course. ⁓

Christian
Thank you, Julia.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
real easy to get a reading by phone, by video, even email. So, yeah.

Christian
Beautiful. Yeah, thanks for sharing that. We'll put all the links in the description as well as the links to all your books.

Julia Gordon-Bramer
Thank you so much, Christian. It was a pleasure.

Christian
Thank you, Julia.